The next is the transcript of the interview with White Home Nationwide Financial Council Director Kevin Hassett that aired on “Face the Nation with Margaret Brennan” on Dec. 21, 2025.
MARGARET BRENNAN: We go now to the Director of the White Home Nationwide Financial Council, Kevin Hassett, good morning to you.
KEVIN HASSETT, DIRECTOR NATIONAL ECONOMIC COUNCIL: Good morning.
MARGARET BRENNAN: We took you actually. You mentioned final Sunday you’d come again and speak to us about that family survey, the roles image. You mentioned you actually belief it. That report got here out. It confirmed America added 64,000 jobs, with unemployment ticking as much as 4.6%. However we have seen evaluation, together with from the highest economist at us, navy, federal, saying the US is in a quote, hiring recession. Only a few jobs being added for the reason that spring, and wage beneficial properties are slowing. Are we in a hiring recession?
HASSETT: No, I do not assume so. I feel that principally, the quantity was about what the market anticipated. It was a quantity that was lower than 100 which is slightly bit decrease than you want. However then after that, we received the patron worth index numbers, which had been actually wonderful. And so if you happen to take a look at the three month transferring common of core shopper costs, then they’re operating at an annual price of about 1.6% means under the Fed’s goal. And my previous good friend, all the best way again to grad college, Austin Goolsby, is now one of many Fed governors voting on rates of interest, conceded that they need to have reduce charges quicker and that he is going to take action sooner or later due to this inflation quantity.
MARGARET BRENNAN: He was one of many dissenters when the Fed’s resolution got here out. However on the subject of inflation, as you simply referred to, that quantity confirmed there was nonetheless an increase in inflation, it was simply at a slower tempo than anticipated. If you happen to pull out vitality and pull out meals, it rose on the slowest tempo since 2021 up 2.6% in November from a 12 months in the past. However then there are quirks in right here, as a result of it seems like the costs weren’t gathered till Thanksgiving reductions kicked in. There was no improve mirrored when it comes to housing prices. Why do you belief the information now, when you have not prior to now?
HASSETT: Oh, , I feel that you just’re proper to all the time be suspicious about information, and it will look quite a bit cleaner after we get a full survey, which we did not have this time. However , two of the three numbers, if we return to the three month transferring common, we’re advantageous. And so I feel that the error band across the 1.6% inflation, about that is the tempo it is operating might be fairly tight. Certainly there might be supervisions, however I feel the numbers are about proper, and I normally, Margaret, do not prefer to go to 12 months over 12 months after we’re speaking about what is going on on with inflation, as a result of that features lots of excessive inflation Biden months within the again, and fewer and fewer as we get additional into the 12 months. However I feel that the trajectory proper now’s greatest seen by the three month transferring common, and that is under two, under the Fed goal. So it means the Fed, as Austan Goolsbee mentioned, has loads of room to chop charges.
MARGARET BRENNAN: However the President mentioned inflation has stopped. You’d acknowledge that is an exaggeration.
HASSETT: Effectively, I assume the inflation being above the goal has stopped, for positive, and so, however inflation isn’t zero Additionally, that is honest.
MARGARET BRENNAN: Okay, he didn’t give these caveats. He simply mentioned inflation has stopped. However Kevin, Kevin Hassett, stick with us. I’ve received to take a fast break, and I need to discuss the remainder of what we have discovered. On the opposite aspect of it. We have got extra questions. Stick with us.
PART 1 ENDS
PART 2 STARTS
MARGARET BRENNAN: Welcome again to Face The Nation, and we proceed our dialog now with the Director of the White Home Nationwide Financial Council Kevin Hassett. This previous week, we noticed the President announce additional modifications to immigration coverage. He halted range visas. There at the moment are 39 international locations on this journey ban or restricted record. That is along with all of the deportations and revocations of asylum. The enterprise group has made clear that the fixed modifications make it exhausting for them to plan, notably within the small enterprise class. They’re involved a couple of labor scarcity and we have seen the U.S. workforce lose greater than 1 million foreign-born staff prior to now 12 months. Are you listening to these considerations from the enterprise group?
HASSETT: Really, it is the other. So within the sense that native-born staff are up greater than 2 million. And so what we have seen is that as foreign-born staff, and lots of them, do not forget, had been unlawful immigrants which were deported, that when foreign-born staff depart, then it creates jobs for people who find themselves native-born. The fascinating factor too, which I might prefer to remind everyone, is that native-born People aren’t essentially racially distinct in any respect. And so the vast majority of the native-born jobs which were created during the last 12 months are Hispanic People. It is, , simply principally taking of us which are legally within the nation and getting the roles to them is what we see within the information.
MARGARET BRENNAN: Effectively the Related Normal Contractors of America did not say they’re changing these staff simply. They’re saying they’re having a tough time doing that, and issued a press release saying it is a important problem, urging the administration to take a look at methods to increase the development workforce and permit extra folks to lawfully enter the nation.
HASSETT: Proper. Effectively, one of many issues we’re seeing, that is precisely how markets work. Proper? So development staff, their salaries this 12 months have gone up by $3,300 on common, in line with the newest report —
MARGARET BRENNAN: — As a result of the shortage?
HASSETT: Effectively, however when the value goes up, then folks say, oh, I ought to go and I was a development employee, however now I am doing one thing else. I ought to return to development work as a result of the salaries are so excessive. And so we’re seeing lots of that go on. And so we’re very bullish on development, and actually blissful to see that wages are going means again up. And so as a substitute of getting, , principally unlawful folks are available in and take jobs away from native-born People at low wages, we’re seeing folks reenter the labor pressure at excessive wages.
MARGARET BRENNAN: However to be clear from the enterprise group a part of the query is what’s authorized? Since you’re altering the definition and pulling again asylum from some teams. So there’s confusion on the fixed change in coverage. Will there be readability within the new 12 months?
HASSETT: Oh, there will certainly be readability within the new 12 months. And I feel there’s readability now that what we have performed is that we have made it in order that persons are legally residents of the nation and legally allowed to work, that they are, , principally high of the record once you’re in search of any person to rent.
MARGARET BRENNAN: Let me ask you a bit about tariffs. Since way back to July, we’ve got heard the president consult with this concept of $2,000 checks being given out to households. The Treasury secretary mentioned this is able to go to households making lower than $100,000. Ought to People plan to obtain these checks in 2026?
HASSETT: That is going to depend upon what occurs with Congress. Congress goes to need to ship these cash to these peoples. However the factor we are able to say is that since July, we have had lots of optimistic information concerning the economic system. We have had a few quarters of virtually 4% development. We have got an enormous authorities surplus really operating for just a few months in a row. The deficit relative to final 12 months, is down by $600 billion and so in the summertime, I wasn’t so positive that there was area for a test like that, however now I am fairly positive that there’s, and so I’d anticipate that within the new 12 months, the President will carry forth a proposal to Congress to make that occur.
MARGARET BRENNAN: So a brand new proposal for these, it isn’t essentially coming from current tariff income?
HASSETT: Effectively, it may come from from tariff income, however in the long run, , we get taxes, we get tariffs, we get income from plenty of locations, after which Congress decides tips on how to spend these monies. That is an appropriation. And so this must be cash that might be an appropriation.
MARGARET BRENNAN: So do not financial institution on it, in different phrases. So are you projecting that within the new 12 months sure tariffs will stay in place, or do you see a few of them going away?
HASSETT: I feel that a lot of the tariffs that we have handed this 12 months have confirmed their mettle. We have got nonetheless excessive development, which individuals mentioned we could not if we had tariffs. We have now discount within the deficit. Discount within the commerce deficit. Imports from China are the bottom they have been since China entered the WTO. So there’s lots of success to crow about within the tariff area. However there are additionally issues that we’re listening to after we speak to folks like buying and selling companions and corporations that commerce quite a bit within the U.S.. There are additionally issues that possibly might be adjusted. You noticed that we determined to exempt espresso, for instance, as a result of we do not make lots of espresso within the U.S.
MARGARET BRENNAN: –And low costs are up.
HASSETT: And I feel that if there’s one thing that is not made within the U.S. in any respect, that there is an urge for food, and Jamieson Greer is main the hassle to check these issues, that there is an urge for food to exempt issues in the event that they’re actually not meant to be made within the U.S. due to, , like local weather or issues like that.
MARGARET BRENNAN: You’ve got additionally go received the Supreme Court docket resolution pending when it comes to the precise IEEPA, as they’re known as, these are tariffs the place the justification was citing fentanyl, Canadian crude, some Chinese language imports. If the Supreme Court docket does not discover in your favor, who will get the refund? Is it the businesses, or is it the customers? How does that work?
HASSETT: Yeah, we actually anticipate the Supreme Court docket goes to search out with us, and I additionally assume that in the event that they did not discover with us, that it will be fairly unlikely that they’ll name for widespread refunds, as a result of it will be an administrative drawback to get these refunds out to there. However principally, whoever paid the tariff, like, really reduce the test to purchase the factor, could be the one that could be getting the refund, if there have been one.
MARGARET BRENNAN: Would not the administration declare it was the nation that paid that? You are saying the corporate.
HASSETT: It could be- like, I am not speaking concerning the incidence, proper? That like, so the incidence of the tariff. So in the long run, who pays the tariff is dependent upon elasticities of provide and demand, and we all know that China reduce the value quite a bit, in order that the publish tariff worth from Chinese language items is about what it was earlier than the tariff. However the individuals who pay the tariff, if there’s a refund, the individuals who really paid for the great, the importer, most often, they’re those who could be the primary line of protection for refunding the tariff. However I actually, actually do not assume that is going to occur, it might be very sophisticated. After which that individual could be chargeable for allocating the tariff refund to the suitable of us.
MARGARET BRENNAN: That feels like a large number.
HASSETT: Sure, it’s a mess, and that is why I feel the Supreme Court docket would not do it.
MARGARET BRENNAN: Effectively, we’ll wait and see. I need to rapidly ask you concerning the oil market. I requested you final Sunday about that call to grab a tanker off the coast of Venezuela. We noticed yet one more one over the weekend. You mentioned final Sunday, it in all probability will not have an effect on oil costs to be taking this oil off the black market. Do you stand by that? And was all that oil going to China?
HASSETT: Yeah, , I have never been briefed on the newest. I did see that that is one other ship that was principally working within the black market. And so there have been slightly bit, there’s been slightly little bit of black market exercise within the oil sector to go to sanctioned international locations and to get them some oil. They usually’re getting that oil to be able to keep away from the reforms that we predict would make international locations a greater place. And so it isn’t lots of oil in comparison with world provide. And so I do not assume that folks should be nervous right here within the U.S. that the costs are going to go up due to these seizures of those ships. There’s simply a few them, they usually had been black market ships.
MARGARET BRENNAN: Had been these sanctioned ships going to China?
HASSETT: I am unsure the place they had been going.
MARGARET BRENNAN: All proper. Kevin Hassett, thanks in your time–
HASSETT: Thanks.
MARGARET BRENNAN: Have an amazing vacation. We’ll be proper again.
